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Author Topic: Unable to restore SQL Server 2012 DB to SQL Server 2008  (Read 955 times)

cmware

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Unable to restore SQL Server 2012 DB to SQL Server 2008
« on: August 25, 2013, 04:33:30 AM »
I cant believe the lack of customer consideration in forcibly upgrading all our SQL Server DBs from 2008 to 2012, and the legacy maintenance issues and work it is now causing us.

Arvixes only email warning was on 5th Aug 2103, foloweed by on 2 days later saying it was all finished. GULP! I am so busy I dont usually even get a chance to properly catch up with all my weeks emails till the next weekend. Thats no warning at all, nor any choice?  It didnt even give us sufficient time to take fresh backups.

So now the only backups we can get are SQL Server 2012, which cant be restored to SQL Server 2008 to work on offline. How do we fix a production issue if one was to occur right now ???

The response I got from your support staff was
   1) to go out and buy SQL Server 2012 ($4,000 for Standard Edition) and
   2) sales spin about how much better it is.

It felt like I was talking with Microsofts marketing dept.

Question: Is your hosting service aimed at hobbyists? Or at commercial applications were migrations to newer versions of tools needs to be agreed and planned by all affected? Some aren't even just up to us, the developers, they have to include our paying customers with SLAs.

We have at least one live database used by customers that is subject to being auditable under financial laws that we now cant restore offline to SQL Server 2008 at all.

Any professional developer knows, you do NOT work against your live DB. You work against an offline copy in isolation. What if we had a problem with that right? How would we get a copy we could restore to SQL Server 2008 to investigate?

I have worked as a professional .Net and SQL Server developer for many many years, and no commercial organisation would just upgrade DBs on existing live commercial applications without it being planned and co-ordinated well in advance with at minimum the developers.

SQL Server 2008 and 2012 can co-exist. You could have left 2008 there and only upgraded those who had applications that they were ready to have migrated.

We are now going to be FORCED by Arvixe to have to get SQL Server 2012 and will have to spend the next few weeks trying to change all our development environments and tools over to use SQL Server 2012.

This is one of the reasons we left our last hosting company. A complete disregard for the impact these sort of changes have on customers.  When applications are live it is NOT just about the new shiny functionality in development tools.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2013, 04:47:08 AM by cmware »

ZArvixe

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Re: Unable to restore SQL Server 2012 DB to SQL Server 2008
« Reply #1 on: August 25, 2013, 04:50:08 AM »
Hello,

We are upgrading all old servers to better hardware and latest softwares. SQL Server 2012 is one of them. Migration completion just means that the services have been switched to new server. It really doesn't mean that old server is cancelled and we can not assist clients in getting any required data from old server. We keep the migrated servers online for more than a week or two and when no complaint is received, it is cancelled. Just to mention, dahlia server was migrated on 7th of this month.

Please pm me your databases names so that I can check if we can get databases backups for you from SQL Server 2008.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2013, 04:54:33 AM by ZArvixe »
Zee Shan
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cmware

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Re: Unable to restore SQL Server 2012 DB to SQL Server 2008
« Reply #2 on: August 25, 2013, 04:59:03 AM »
You have completely ignored my concerns.

I am deciding here whether to look for a new hosting company.

ZArvixe

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Re: Unable to restore SQL Server 2012 DB to SQL Server 2008
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2013, 05:13:20 AM »
I understand your concerns. But the server was having serious issues. It was rebooting frequently on its own so we had to migrate the user data and switch services to new server on urgent basis to prevent any major failure that can result in data loss. With the upgrade to new technologies, small fraction of sites may need changes and we work with any such users in getting their sites back online provided we are notified timely so that any data can be recovered from old server if required.

I have moved your ticket to Server Migrations queue so that I can work with you in getting the databases recovered.
Zee Shan
Sr. Technical Operations Officer
zee.shan@arvixe.com
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cmware

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Re: Unable to restore SQL Server 2012 DB to SQL Server 2008
« Reply #4 on: August 25, 2013, 05:19:25 AM »
I am not on about servers or hardware.

I am talking about migrating databases from SQL Server 2008 to SQL Server 2012.

You don't need to do that just because of issues with hardware.

ZArvixe

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Re: Unable to restore SQL Server 2012 DB to SQL Server 2008
« Reply #5 on: August 25, 2013, 05:34:30 AM »
We deploy all new servers with the same OS and softwares so that we can keep a standard setup across all of our servers. SQL Server was definitely not resulting in server issues but upgrade to SQL Server 2012 was part of a complete server upgrade. Due to server issues, migration was just done ahead of time. If the server was not rebooting on its own, the upgrade would have been done after few weeks but this upgrade was in the plan as we are upgrading all old servers.
Zee Shan
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Mourad D.

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Re: Unable to restore SQL Server 2012 DB to SQL Server 2008
« Reply #6 on: August 25, 2013, 06:25:33 AM »
Quote
I cant believe the lack of customer consideration in forcibly upgrading all our SQL Server DBs from 2008 to 2012, and the legacy maintenance issues and work it is now causing us.

I totally agree with your words, and assure you that billions of other Microsoft users do feel the same way, but I think you are complaining from the wrong persons here.

The issue is not that we are forcing customers to move forward, but are actually part of the people or organizations who are being forced to use new up to date software.

We have always known that the company always tries to push people towards getting the new software and actually ISOLATES everyone else who is still using the old software until at one point it becomes obsolete and incompatible with the trend.

To be able to provide top services, we have to migrate to newer server hardware and with that, we need to use new OS as the old ones are no longer available.
Mourad Dmeiri
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AmandaLittle

Re: Unable to restore SQL Server 2012 DB to SQL Server 2008
« Reply #7 on: August 26, 2013, 08:37:35 AM »
Hi There,

I'm Amanda and I am a member of the Quality Assurance department. I was so sorry to hear your disappointment with our upgrade and I wanted to reach out.

You've gotten a lot of responses about why we chose to upgrade our servers to a newer version. I know it must be difficult to hear so many (what seem like "excuses") but the fact of the matter is, for server stability and security it was a move we had to make.

That said, it was change we had to make across the board, on all of our servers. As a company of over 70,000 customers, we had some very important decisions to make. Of course we knew that it wouldn't be perfect and that there would be growing pains but at the end of the day those growing pains are inevitable and we had to make the move we did. With as many customers as there are, we sadly and unfortunately cannot wait for every customer to get back to us with an A-OK.

I wish that wasn't the case, but it's the nature of a shared hosting environment. I'm going to level with you. Could we have improved this process? Yes. Will we learn from it? Absolutely.

However, we knew this change was necessary and wasn't just about shiny new equipment. We heard the complaints about stability from our many customers and we acted as we had to. I want to reiterate that I am sincerely sorry that this caused so much inconvenience for you and I assure you it's not lost on us. We will absolutely learn from this and hope you can understand where we're coming from as well.

I would hate to lose you as a client over this and while I can respect whatever decision you make, I really hope that my follow up has helped somehow in explaining where we're coming from, and what we're thinking going through this process.

Have you considered a Virtual Machine? Something that you have more control over in terms of updates etc? Please let us know if this is something you'd be interested in.


jeffsti

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Re: Unable to restore SQL Server 2012 DB to SQL Server 2008
« Reply #8 on: August 27, 2013, 03:05:56 PM »
I'd thought I put my two cents into this discussion as I wasn't even aware this upgrade had occurred. On one hand, this is good news as my sites are very simple and apparently "just worked"

However, I never received any sort of notification, email or otherwise, and even if I had, two days is not sufficient notice for most sites of any respectable size. In a perfect world things would work without issue but in reality people need time to test and possibly rework their sites or code when the underlying services or changed.

I seem recall a similar lack of notice for the "upgrade" to .net 4.5.

To me, the issue here is not that the SQL upgrade was needed or not, but how customer are notified and presented with enough time to react. And I agree, just because server hardware needed to upgrade does not always mean the software installed (i.e. SQL Server) necessarily needs to be. Even if it was on the radar, combining them isn't always the best option for the customers.

victor.gebhardt

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Re: Unable to restore SQL Server 2012 DB to SQL Server 2008
« Reply #9 on: August 27, 2013, 04:02:56 PM »
Hello,

I apologize for the inconvenience and understand your frustration. We will work to be more communicative regarding these sorts of upgrades going forward. I will forward this thread to the head of the department responsible for server migrations and have him provide you with a further update.
Victor Gebhardt
Shift Manager
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ZArvixe

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Re: Unable to restore SQL Server 2012 DB to SQL Server 2008
« Reply #10 on: August 28, 2013, 02:12:57 AM »
@jeffsti,

We appreciate your concerns and I have taken note of it. I will make sure that for all future migrations, users are notified atleast a week before.
Zee Shan
Sr. Technical Operations Officer
zee.shan@arvixe.com
1-888-927-8493

 

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